The RIGHT Way to Throw Distance Forehands [ROASTING My Form] | Feat. @OverthrowDiscGolf

welcome back to Bonanza disc golf today we're going to be breaking down the forehand and to do that I have help from overthrow disc golf which if you're watching my channel you might know are some of the best disc golf coaches in the game they also have a YouTube channel that I'll link down below but this is all because this is Project 100 which is my off season training that I'm inviting you guys into so that you can see how I'm training to get onto the pro tour next year at least playing some events and trying to get a tour card for 2024 but also a way for you to get better at disc golf however you want and there's a Facebook group that goes along with this I'm trying to launch a Discord here pretty soon I'm just embedded Discord so I have some help from some of my patrons but real quick project 100 is essentially three main tenants one is a hundred putts per day for me that's making them for you it can be doing 100 puts a day on average honestly for this I did most of my putts except I didn't putt yesterday and I haven't put yet today but I did the same thing earlier in the week and then I just made 200 putts the next day which is what I plan to do today after this video goes live and if I haven't done it and you post tomorrow and the first person to say have you done your puts yet if I don't do 200 putts today I'll set send you out of free Bonanza disc golf first run disc which I still have some available on my website even though the pier sold out and I don't think anyone's gonna get that because I'm gonna do my 200 bucks today the other two main things are doing one fieldwork session and one non-disc golf workout now I did my non-discoff workout last night with some footage here for Planet Fitness where honestly I just walked and did a little bit of stretching because I have a tournament tomorrow that I'm trying to get ready for it but even just that I'm counting because it was a non-discoff workout and it definitely made me feel better so I'm excited to continue doing that but my field work session was twofold I did backhand and film that and forehand and film that and the forehand is what I sent to overthrow for now we're gonna work on the backhand later in future videos but this week we're gonna break down the coaching session that I had with Josh and basically everything that I had to learn in order to make my forehand not only go farther which might be something that happens but more importantly actually help my body because as I learned I am doing some things that could hurt me if I try to do this over the long run so to give Josh some context send them all this footage of me throwing my forehand from both the side and the back view as well as one from the front and my average forehand distance here we were going slightly uphill and maybe like a three to five mile an hour headwind my average is around 325 to 340 when I had one that I got 361 feet and I arranged all this and so I let him know all of this and this is what he had to say yeah the distance is fine like if you're throwing 360 380 on a forehand you'll be fine on tour the hard thing about tour is that with your current form if you threw 360 to 380 every tournament and practice rounds and stuff like that your arm would like give out because you're not using as much body it's more about in my opinion it's not about adding distance for you which it may or may not happen it's about conserving the arm I really appreciated this because this is for sure true I don't think to be on tour you need like the biggest of everything you just need to be very consistent and accurate you need to put very well and you want to make sure that you can be there for a long time so that's really what I'm looking for is longevity on tour and then if you get good form you can build off that good form to add distance later down the road but you need to start with a good foundation which is what this coaching session is about for me and one of the first things that you have to think about when you're looking at a forehand is is your grip there are multiple different forehand grips for sure some people will grip it like this which is how I tend to do it I used to grip it like this some people will do it like this and here's what Josh has to say about his General thoughts on how grip works with the forehand probably I mean there's a range with grip yeah some people are like all the way fingers there right what we can't do is fingers totally on the flight plate you know if something's touching the rim and something touching a flight plate seems to me to be easier for angle control and this is actually why I change because what I used to do is I used to have this forehand grip I think it's maybe because I played some ultimate before but there's not really a lot that's on the flight plate everything's against the rim so it's really easy to kind of like gather some Spin and throw it off of your middle finger off the rim however the big problem with this is since nothing's on the flight plate it's flopping between my knuckle on my index finger right here and so there's not as much stability as when I change to this grip now the disc isn't flopping in that location it's only flopping at the top of it so that gives me a lot more consistent clean release which is something that I wasn't kidding and sometimes I would throw the forehand really well but sometimes I would totally shake it and a lot of it is because I couldn't really trust it because if I had a little bit of off axis torque which we'll talk about a little later it just it would flop out of my hand in a really weird way so after we kind of looked at how my grip was and his General thoughts ungrip he started to break down the first big thing that I really needed to work on in my form which is what is essentially causing me to rip my shoulder off two issues that I see so the big thing is as you step here with this right step your foot is very forward what that's going to do is it's going to have your hips stay forward your right foot is going to cause your hips to stay more forward and more open Andrew's this way so this right step if I'm throwing this way here needs to be more or less about 90 off it could be a little bit forward which is fine but the goal here for this load and setup step is for the hips to be away in the shoulders and you almost have the setup here but during this right step the off arm the left arm needs to shoot across like this bent and you see it's helping me keep my shoulders closed as well yeah and then we're striding this way obviously and so I would practice that both hands over this way kind of the uh you know bird over the over the nest here this is where the goods are at is this more in terms of getting better load and power instead of like the longevity of my throat well it's both so this is the coil allowing us to use um what I'll call the unit which is like the Torso the core the shoulders all that so this unit turn here allows us to have a range of motion so that from here to here this is I'm not moving my arm at all this is using my body so we just kind of move the whole unit this way so set up and then as we go the whole thing moves and then the hand kicks in here has this little action here an important action but a small one versus if we're forward with this foot we go forward now how far can the body really pull the hand and your shoulder is going to rip right so from here so you're already open with the hips so if you were here and you used the hips you would shank it off a left nobody's going to do that right so what they're going to do is if they step here with the right they're gonna go boom and use the hand all the way from here to here protect the arm by setting up the body to swing but the biggest thing is the close to perpendicular on that last step so that you your hips pull you through instead of my arm because my arm is doing a lot of pulling right now I feel like I'm throwing the disc instead of letting my body push the disc out which would make sense that's what I'm saying like if you kept going I I don't care if you had any more distance personally yeah I care if you can have a forehand for the entire time that you're trying to push to be on tour honestly this makes a lot of sense and to be honest for forehand and backhand I haven't done a ton of form work necessarily I've heard some advice and done slight things that I'm like maybe this makes sense but a lot of it has just been intuitively this is how I have thrown farther and when I throw something well I'll take note oh this went good and now I'm going to try that again and so I haven't been able to push up my distance on my forehand and get there and sometimes I'll play around and I don't really feel hurt if I throw a lot of forehands sometimes I do though and I think that's just lack of consistency in my form and not starting from a good foundation because when my hips are so open like that to the Target like they're already facing the target my arm is doing all of the work instead of my body doing most of the work and my arm just kind of flicking it at the very end which is what you really need to be worrying about but that brings us into the second main thing which has less to do with my right foot and more to do with my plant foot yeah then the other thing is this last step here and this is partly based on where your right foot came from right you couldn't swing your hips properly because of how you stepped your base imagine running this way with your feet forward forward what's going to happen if you try to stop well you're going to leak forward as you go and so now you take this big forward step because if you try to stop while you were running on a single step this is what would happen but what happens with Andrew is since he's coming in closed like that his hips kind of rotate in place so this right hip swings forward and this left hip swings back actually a little bit so now his left hip ends up behind his right hip and he doesn't move from the spot this last move is from here we go and plant and then the hips rotate in place here instead of here step and and like pulling the right hip forward hips are closed or neutral depending on how you want to look at it and then when you go to stride they open last second and then they start swinging this way and so right hip forward left hip back it's similar to the first point but the hips themselves are a little bit different and this is one of the things that you might be thinking about even when you watch like backhand is sometimes you'll notice it yourself either on forehand or backhand like I have done and I'm starting to really try to dial in and work on is I will fall over the t-pad and I used to essentially like jump off the t-pad when I started that just magnetized something on there I think we'll throw this on a mini now but essentially also you get a mini with every order essentially what happens though is that's because you're like I'm like basically running forward instead of having rotational energy so it's much more forward momentum instead of rotational momentum and because of that when you watch Pros they kind of just look like they throw it and then they just like they just stop and they just stand there forehand or backhand and that always confused me so much but it's because they're rotating into a position where they have like an equilibrium of force with one hip going forward one going backwards and so that's one of the things that we're definitely going to be working on and you know Josh said he had two things that he wanted to talk to me about well he lied there's a third I I should have mentioned this or I meant to mention this earlier yeah I said two things I'm in three things so you see how your palms flipping up here Palm up nose up Palm down nose down so as you come through yeah like you can learn you can throw like I could learn to throw and hit super nose down your like default is with your palm just a little bit up so you just need to learn in iron out this this specific hit just like a matter of figuring out how my palm approaches this like for me I know like here's my that's my thrill that's where it comes out nose down or like got good nose angle like that's it if I put a disc in my hand here it's there good nose Angle now this is something I actually intentionally developed now I realize now that it's wrong but the way that I did it I'm not too mad about because I did it for a very specific purpose you might have heard a lot of people talk about rolling their wrist when they throw a forehand and that comes when you release the forehand and you roll it this way we're actually going to touch on this a little bit later for some underlying causes that aren't just in your wrist but how you actually approach the forehand throw so that's those are very Illuminating as well but in order to stop that I really focused on just keeping my palm up keeping my palm open because then you can't really roll your wrist you can't really roll your wrist if you keep your palm open like that so that's something I've intentionally worked on is keeping my palm like this however that's why I tend to have a Mist that is nose up my throws tend to be close to the ground a lot of it's because I have to stride so far and get so low to the ground instead of staying upright and actually rotating my hips but because of that I also didn't want to burn shots into the ground so I'd prefer to miss up so I'd at least get some distance but that just causes a very inconsistent flight exactly I was talking about is what I'm gonna have to nail down is instead of focusing on throwing those up keeping my palm up it's focusing on where is my hit point this right here is pretty much where I feel comfortable with my hit point when I release it like that it's a really solid forehand and so I'm really focusing on just like reps and Reps and Reps which is one of the reasons why I'm trying to get my hands on a good net to practice because then I can just practice low reps and some other things that we're going to talk about called Shadow swings um to really just help nail down my hip Point boom every time there that's still actually a little up I need a lot of work to do I've only done a little bit of training since this session next week's going to be all about the training that I do and how this affects things is there anything else with my upper body that like keeping my elbow more tucked or closer or changing the way that I approach the forehand you can lay your wrist back more I think you could start with your wrist laid back but that's that's in that same setup position that we were talking about that's all that's all here when you're across here the wrist should be laid back right foot this way off arm not just like a cross but also back here shoulders yeah yeah help keep their shoulders turned and some guys even have here like where they help keep their wrists back with their off hand you don't have to do that you can do that but yeah so that's all in this position and then from here the upper body as you start moving this here is gonna probably take care of itself in other words it's not something I would address now and this is something that I've heard a lot as well is just keeping your wrist cocked back because what I often do is my wrist is kind of in this position which is more neutral and so I have this much range of motion forward instead of if my wrist is cocked back that adds so much more range of motion and even just in that little throw from here this my end already feels faster just doing that so really focusing keeping that back along with my shoulders up keeping my shoulders coiled this all being one unit and just keeping that back every single time before I practice that throw but now we're gonna get into kind of aiming kind of how your elbow needs to be because we didn't really work a lot on upper body here we're really focusing on lower body because that's what's going to help our upper body because if our lower body works it's going to make it a lot easier for that to work as well but there are a couple of things that might give you indications as to why you're doing some things poorly and this definitely was a case for me so let's check this out real fast if I'm trying to throw at you you should see my elbow the entire time I set up right if not you're gonna do some weird stuff like if I start walking across here now I'm gonna have to go here and then at the last second I'm gonna have to correct with my hand and that's when people start turning stuff over because the correction with the hand is like this when people try to throw further instead of just keeping the elbow over here they try to wind up more and now the elbow's behind them so now the tendency is an early release or again you go here and then they try to correct it and I noticed this all the time because I would early release and just like I'd be like okay I gotta get it and then I would try to like reach back and have like a quote unquote reach back and end up following through either too much and because I overcompensate I throw it away anhyzer and way left or I early release and I really release a lot Are there specific drills that would be helpful to work on this or just recording form and thinking through it yeah you probably don't need a drill for it I mean I would go through and just like we worked on check your setup before you move forward into the throw get all your checkpoints it's my off arm across is my elbow out and Away in my it's not like my body's not blocking my elbows lined to the throw is my foot or my hips this way is my chest on my shoulders this way would you recommend starting with just a one step up so starting in that closed position and then going into throat instead of trying a run-up so that I can get used to the correct movement yeah I mean that's probably a way to do it is start from that step and just start maybe even like feet together and then arms here so feet together Target line over this way elbow check off arm check wrist check shoulders hips are obviously this way because you can't stand like this and then step and then throw there are some drills on this channel if you don't have this specific coaching session also I'll link his patreon down below which is how he does all this coaching it was a really good session I'm going to be doing a lot more with him and I'll bring you everything as I go through this coaching so go check out his channel and his patreon down link below and there are a lot of form drills and other drills on his channel to work on just any Myriad of things in case forehand isn't the thing that you're working on right now but I wanted to ask as well like how many throws should I be doing a day like should I go out and do a hundred a day is 20 a day too much like what do I really need to work on and focus on and he gave me a pretty solid solution that can let you train as much or as little as you need or want to get it done if you go out and try to throw 400 foot forehands I'm gonna say yeah 20 is probably too many yeah but if you're just working on it and the dissolent you're only putting in 150 feet of effort like low strain on the body you can throw more what's more important is for expediency is that you do Shadow swings without throwing get it in the muscle memory that's no toll on the body but it's mental and muscle memory reps right so get that prep down you can do that 200 times a day but it doesn't matter your body's gonna be fine but once you go out into a field I wouldn't even try to set new records what I usually tell uh if you're throwing three 60 380 right now when you get after it I'd say let's just work on a smooth 300. yeah we're a smooth 275. and I've actually tried the shadow swing thing and I sometimes found it helped me to at least get into the shadow swing when I put a disc in my hand and really focused on okay this is what it looks like with a disc in my hand not throwing the disc but having it in my hand and then I took it out of my hand and it was a little bit easier just to get me into that mode as long as I focus on that very first one so that my like you said those neural Pathways don't come back and be like oh we've done this before that's something I'm gonna be working on a lot when I'm doing my 100 pots a day just do 10 to 50 Shadow swings and make sure that they're good quality reps because you don't want to practice something poorly because that's what will get ingrained in you so I'm gonna record myself to make sure I'm not doing things poorly and watch it back because if I'm not doing something right or there's something I should tweak a little bit I want to get that done first and make sure I'm practicing correctly but there's one last question that I had for Josh because if you watch this which is looking at my forehand from a back view you see especially in this super slow-mo how much wobble there is and so I asked him like this is normally called off axis torque and he said that the main reason it happens is because you're throwing faster relative to the amount of spin that you have on the disc but essentially this is I think for now just focus on what we've mentioned and the wrist on the backswing I think is going to help cool just making sure the wrist is cocked yeah we'll address it when uh we have a better Foundation to work off of but the wrist back this motion right here almost all of the spin yeah I don't think it makes sense to go any further than what we did so far focus on one thing at a time and uh Master it make it so you can't get it wrong before you move on to the next one so that's the plan and to be honest with you a day or two after this I had a really sweet collaboration that's gonna be coming within the next couple of weeks with the produce golfer here in Pensacola and during that time I like put this into practice a little bit or at least thought more about my forehand and the way that it works and it's not as perfect as I'd want it to be especially because this is like literally the next day after we had talked just one session in a couple Shadow swings just thinking about my form in the correct way helps me to really not feel like I was throwing far but this shot right here also sick those are three sick sidearms that's really good literally put it to about 10 feet on I think what's a 390 foot hole and I wasn't like trying to get it down there I was just trying to hit a gap it was slightly downhill it might not even been that far no it's kind of it's got to be 370 to 390. yeah wow that's really good forehand and I I didn't get it right every time here's my first forehand of the day trying to focus on this I'm the same exact hole because maybe we went to a playoff but there's so much just in figuring out my body that really helped and I didn't my shoulder felt amazing because I didn't feel like I was throwing the disc I felt like I was snapping the disc out of my hand and my forehand felt so much better so the more I work on this the more I'm excited and that's really my main focus of this week and next week we're gonna come back and say this is how things have changed I'm gonna try to not do a distance thing but we're also gonna work on putting and throughout the weeks I'm actually going to start trying to put up a few more project 100-ish videos we'll call it like project 101 like the basics of disc golf or something which are just like things that I'm realizing as I am training because I'm trying to put out videos every day subscribe to get me to 10K by the end of the year that's my main goal and if something like that happens I don't to commit to it now but I'm thinking of doing something crazy for my first mpo tournament but subscribing would definitely help with that go check out Josh's Channel if you want to see the full coaching session or at least a lot more of it there are like just some extra little things that didn't make sense to put in this video that are over in that and that's on my patreon if you want to join that I have three different tiers at the third tier you can actually tell me which disc you want me to review and I'll review those a lot of those in the works some of them already up on the channel like this one for The Prodigy F5 if you want to still work on forehand and think through those type of things go watch this video from overthrow but if you want to stay on my channel and are interested in getting started with project 100 here is the first video which has a baseline test for you as well as the whole plans for project 100 so I appreciate you I'll see in the next one if you want to pick up any of my discs they are linked up here I guess or in the description but I'll see you guys in the next one don't forget the pot that's the big thing but